tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post5794756603797105963..comments2024-03-19T03:20:05.162-04:00Comments on Evo and Proud: Evolution and human behavior: Towards a new paradigm?Peter Frosthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04303172060029254340noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-51174617283643085072011-08-19T14:01:20.260-04:002011-08-19T14:01:20.260-04:00Chris,
I wouldn't rule out the possibility of...Chris,<br /><br />I wouldn't rule out the possibility of "adjustments." Medicine started out as a pseudoscience that killed more patients than it saved. Over time, it gradually developed into a true science.<br /><br />In my opinion, all four of EP's founding assumptions need adjusting. Tooby and Cosmides themselvs have backed away from the notion that the EEA is located on the savannas of Pleistocene Africa. Perhaps, we'll see more ...<br /><br />But there are reasons why EP cannot easily evolve towards a more realistic understanding of human behavior and evolution. You referred to them in your comment.<br /><br />I don't wish to belittle the pressures that people suffer, especially in an academic context. But there's also a lot of unfounded paranoia. Sometimes, we are our own worst persecutors.Peter Frostnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-16781580433597682332011-08-18T23:24:15.996-04:002011-08-18T23:24:15.996-04:00I think there's a bit of a non sequitur in the...I think there's a bit of a non sequitur in the argument that concludes that evolutionary psychology is fundamentally flawed, or that we must somehow abandon one of its four founding assumptions. My perception is that evo psych is still a young theory, undergoing adjustments and alterations as new data come in. None of the data you cite strikes at the heart of evo psych; it can be addressed with adjustments. In any case, I'll be most interested to learn which of the four fundamental assumptions you propose to overturn, and why you so propose.<br /><br />On another note, I'll note that resistance to evo psych remains intense; on at least three occasions I have experienced ferocious and vicious reactions when I referred to it in lectures or writings.Chris Crawfordhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14926445098765433310noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-3569442570771273132011-08-16T11:59:41.458-04:002011-08-16T11:59:41.458-04:00One component of behavior that human females could...<i><br />One component of behavior that human females could use to attract mates is to be willing to offer sex. However, given that offspring are the result of having sex, and the proximate and ultimate consequences (in terms of personal survival, offspring survival and offspring quality) it would seem that females in higher latitudes need extraordinary skills in selecting the right individuals as potential mates.<br /></i><br /><br />It could be that I am over-thinking things here.<br /><br />After more thought it would seem likely that genes controlling future time orientation would cause individuals to assort. Those who have a higher propensity to wait for something better would be more likely to find each other acceptable.Beyond Anonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-5113013793540862992011-08-16T10:22:47.568-04:002011-08-16T10:22:47.568-04:00It could be maintained by assortative mating, or s...<i><br />It could be maintained by assortative mating, or simply by social class endogamy (which amounts to the same thing more or less).<br /></i><br /><br />Indeed, but that would also suggest that those without these genetic traits have other traits that allow them to assort.<br /><br />It seems to me to be worth exploring the consequences of some of your other speculations. <br /><br />For example, that human females, at least in the higher latitudes, have been selected for attracting mates (and indeed, it seems pretty much all human females preen themselves in ways that non-human females do not.).<br /><br />One component of behavior that human females could use to attract mates is to be willing to offer sex. However, given that offspring are the result of having sex, and the proximate and ultimate consequences (in terms of personal survival, offspring survival and offspring quality) it would seem that females in higher latitudes need extraordinary skills in selecting the right individuals as potential mates.Beyond Anonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-1070199677238484372011-08-16T05:50:30.681-04:002011-08-16T05:50:30.681-04:00Mucked that first link up, here is a better one Th...Mucked that first link up, here is a better one <a href="http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=Cb1HMHirsBQC&pg=PA230&dq=william+h+calvin+throwing&hl=en&ei=MTxKTrLEIYjF8QOF_4i-CQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CD4Q6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=william%20h%20calvin%20throwing&f=false" rel="nofollow">The unitary hypothesis: A common neural circuitry for novel manipulations, language, plan-ahead, and throwing?</a>Todnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-14708423928012592552011-08-16T05:35:19.323-04:002011-08-16T05:35:19.323-04:00It seems to me that Tooby is implying that Cromagn...It seems to me that Tooby is implying that Cromagnons were as smart or smarter than people today.<br /><br /><br />But early Cromagnons used stabbing spears possibly because they couldn't throw <a rel="nofollow">William Calvin's take on the difficulty of throwing</a> <br /><br /><br />( Re. Clarke and the homicide rate in England in the 13th century. According to a TV programe Edward I passed laws which required every man to carry a <a href="http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?q=medieval+dagger&um=1&hl=en&safe=active&sa=N&tbm=isch&tbnid=PIUMq66UOAunsM:&imgrefurl=http://www.wulflund.com/weapons/daggers/swordfight-daggers/&docid=vtddr4b_kwb3gM&w=800&h=600&ei=kTRKTuD7Dces8gPK0fXtCQ&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=618&vpy=339&dur=4588&hovh=194&hovw=259&tx=162&ty=131&page=2&tbnh=150&tbnw=204&start=22&ndsp=22&ved=1t:429,r:8,s:22&biw=1280&bih=827" rel="nofollow">dagger</a> and the murder rate skyrocketed. I don't doubt that Clark is basically correct though.)Todnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-12200350001432710982011-08-15T17:10:49.625-04:002011-08-15T17:10:49.625-04:00FredR,
I've reworded that paragraph a bit bec...FredR,<br /><br />I've reworded that paragraph a bit because Eibl-Eibesfeldt came out with his work "Human Ethology" the same year that Konrad Lorenz died. But he too was already quite old. Ethology is no longer a paradigm that mobilizes research on human behavior.<br /><br />Beyond Anon,<br /><br />It could be maintained by assortative mating, or simply by social class endogamy (which amounts to the same thing more or less).<br /><br />Tod,<br /><br />Evolutionary psychologists will sometimes say (in private) that they're playing a double game. The problem is that they end up believing their phony discourse.<br /><br />In the final analysis, what matters is what you say in public. Private thoughts are fine when you're thinking through an idea. But a time comes when you have to come out and say what you think.<br /><br />M,<br /><br />I'm jumping ahead, but I think the most fertile paradigm is gene-culture co-evolution. Cochran, Harpending, and Hawks (and others) have given us the big picture. Now, we need lots of "small pictures." Clark is a good example of "small picture" analysis in a single human society. We need more of such studies.<br /><br />Henry,<br /><br />Thanks!Peter Frostnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-1200812987410131342011-08-15T10:59:50.133-04:002011-08-15T10:59:50.133-04:00Nice clear summary Peter. Looking forward to the ...Nice clear summary Peter. Looking forward to the next instalment.<br /><br />HCHHenry Harpendingnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-30449330636422618432011-08-14T23:10:53.904-04:002011-08-14T23:10:53.904-04:00Jonathan Haidt's edge essay predicted these is...Jonathan Haidt's edge essay predicted these issues would come to a head between 2012 & 2017. <br /><br />http://www.edge.org/q2009/q09_4.html#haidtMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01133142115539961665noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-86435082554162400002011-08-14T23:07:36.981-04:002011-08-14T23:07:36.981-04:00***So where do we go from here?***
Biohistory lik...***So where do we go from here?***<br /><br />Biohistory like that discussed by Cochran, Harpending & Greg Clark?Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01133142115539961665noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-51143601913696612212011-08-14T08:36:45.324-04:002011-08-14T08:36:45.324-04:00I see this as a case of multilevel group selection...I see this as a case of multilevel group selection. Selfless individual evolutionists do objective science and their paradigm wins out eventually, but the individuals responsible for the new paradigm are inexorably eliminated from paying jobs in academia by self-interested bullshit merchants.Todnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-56898108710861390482011-08-13T13:49:05.160-04:002011-08-13T13:49:05.160-04:00"they had to convince potential employers or ...<b>"they had to convince potential employers or funding agencies that they had no secret interest in psychological differences among human populations."</b> <br /><br />Not quite, what they actually had to do was convince potential employers or funding agencies that they had the <i>correct</i> interest in psychological differences (ie an interest in ensuring the differences were <i>kept</i> secret).Todnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-62524074210259130722011-08-13T12:39:24.513-04:002011-08-13T12:39:24.513-04:00In other words, a woman may be more prone than oth...<i><br />In other words, a woman may be more prone than others to early menarche, a high degree of female reproductive autonomy, and low expectations of paternal investment. It’s not as if she acquires this reproductive strategy from her childhood environment. Instead, she inherits it genetically from her mother and absent father.<br /></i><br /><br />Yes, I had come to that conclusion as well, and suspect that it is likely that such people recognize each others behavior and mate assortatively.Beyond Anonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3734925856292601239.post-57133120576733593192011-08-13T11:03:13.019-04:002011-08-13T11:03:13.019-04:00"By the time of Lorenz’s death in 1989, ethol..."By the time of Lorenz’s death in 1989, ethology had long abandoned any serious study of human behavior."<br /><br />Doesn't the Ethologist Irenaus Eibl-Eibesfeldt, Lorenz's student, study human behavior?FredRnoreply@blogger.com